In this week’s episode of Retire in Texas, Darryl Lyons, CEO and Co-Founder of PAX Financial Group, sits down with PAX Financial Advisor Haley Wall for a heartfelt discussion on the emotional and financial challenges faced by widows.
Drawing from real-life experiences and her work as a certified Loss of Life Advocate, Haley explains how widows can regain clarity and make informed financial decisions after a loss. From navigating life insurance and estate documents to avoiding predatory scams and understanding Social Security’s widow blackout period, this episode offers practical guidance and emotional insight.
Key highlights include:
- The first financial step every widow should take – pause.
- Why widows are often targeted by scammers and opportunists.
- The importance of updating wills, beneficiaries, and medical directives.
- How the widow’s Social Security blackout period works – and how to prepare.
- The emotional weight of stewardship and honoring a spouse’s legacy.
- Available community resources, including grief counseling and support groups.
Whether you’re navigating widowhood yourself or supporting someone who is, this episode offers both compassion and direction.
For more support, visit PAXFinancialGroup.com or contact Haley directly at Haley@PAXFG.com.
Transcript:
Darryl: Hey, this is Darryl Lyons, CEO and Co-Founder of PAX Financial Group. And you’re listening to Retire in Texas. This information is general in nature only. It’s not intended to provide specific investment, tax, or legal advice. Visit PAXFinancialGroup.com for more information. So today I have Haley Wall. She’s a partner here at PAX and an advisor and she does an incredible job working with our community. So, thank you for joining us today.
Haley: Thank you for asking.
Darryl: Yeah, I’m super happy you’re here now. You’ve been working with widows. Can you kind of tell us a little bit about the unique nature of working with widows? I mean, everyone can imagine the pain of loss. But tell us about your experiences so far, working with widows.
Haley: I can tell you the thing that I enjoy the most about it is helping them through all of those unknown questions of, am I going to be okay financially? Do I have to go back to work? Do I do I have to move out of the house? Or am I going to be able to send my kids to college? All of those questions have been really, being a sounding board for those kinds of questions, like you’re.
Darryl: Like a thinking partner.
Haley: Exactly. Because they’ve lost their thinking partner, or maybe the person that did most of the thinking in those spaces is for them. Oftentimes the gentleman is the financial person. That is not always, but oftentimes and sometimes they, I have one widow that feels extremely strongly about honoring her husband’s work and what he did to provide for her. And so, she wants to always make sure that her money is being protected and not losing money, and it’s growing and that she’s making wise decisions with it. She feels that weight, a responsibility of honoring his legacy.
Darryl: Yeah. And you hear the word stewardship a lot right. Yeah, I want to be a good steward. I was reading this morning. This book called Splitting Heirs, and it said that 90% of all women will be single at one point in their lives.
Haley: After marriage, you mean, or just purely.
Darryl: At some point in their lives losing their spouse, just like 90% of all women. And I think about responsibility, like thinking deeply about this topic and managing not only the financial side but the emotional side. So how did you kind of start working with widows? How did that tell me how that worked out? Was it just Darryl saying, you’re going to work with widows?
Haley: I think it was, yeah. Darryl, you introduced me to Esther. You asked me to, Esther Pipoly. Esther with Loss of Life Advocates. And I went through her training to be a certified LOLA advocate. But it, I actually have a history of two really impactful examples of women that are in my life. My sister became a widow at age 32.
Her husband died of cancer at 45, and my niece was 2, and my nephew was 5 at the time. And seeing her get taken advantage of, right. She was in fog and a complete fog. You just, you’re walking around like a zombie. You don’t know what’s going on. And she got taken advantage of, And I felt powerless to help her.
And then I had another friend who had been married for. I think they were married like 30 years, and she lost her husband to cancer as well. And I saw her also get taken advantage of it. And these were both serious, extreme examples of bad things that can happen to widows because they’re in such a vulnerable state. And so, I really enjoy being the person that they can come talk to that can help them navigate those things that they trust to say, okay, this is going on. What do you think about that? You know, yeah.
Darryl: Like, did they get taken advantage of by people that knew them, like in the family in the inner circle, or did somebody kind of like a financial advisor or somebody that sold them a bunch of stuff?
Haley: No, one was family, and friends came in and mooched off of her. And then the other one was, romantic scam, that stinking internet thing where someone posed to be somebody that they weren’t, and they took huge.
Darryl: That’s legit. I mean, Dark Side of Finance. I covered it on that podcast series that we did. That’s so crazy that happens and you’re just lonely and then inner circle and then of course, we also see every week, you know, I share a story about a financial advisor in the marketplace. Widows are vulnerable. And, you know, they tend to have liquidity because they might have got life insurance or something.
Haley: And that’s the other thing. And when the obituary is posted, you know, sharks come out and, my one friend, she was getting calls like daily from people asking her to sell her house. You want to sell your house? I’m sure that’s such a burden that you have to, you know, let me represent you. I know what you’re going through, and, yeah, let me let me help you sell your house, like daily. She was getting phone calls like that.
Darryl: So, like your role, you can kind of be a filter for some of those. First of all, the widow’s just saying. I don’t know if I should sell. I’ve got these emotions to the house. But there’s some of the emotions are good, some are bad. I don’t know. And then like that question alone, the emotional questions, I mean, we can’t resolve that on like, in a financial engagement. We can wrestle with that together, but we can at least maybe resolve the economics of it, of, hey, if you sell your home, you’re going to get this much cash, and you can do this with it. And that at least kind of gives some framework or.
Haley: Right. We can help answer the question; do I have to? And then you get to tackle a question, do I want? And then what are what are the tradeoffs that you get with it so that you’re not making that fear based emotional decision? You can make a logical decision as best as possible.
Darryl: Thank you. I didn’t mean to cut you off. I just want to tell people who are listening. If you know somebody that’s a widow, whether it just recently or it’s been a while, I do recommend that you connect them with Haley. Haley does have a heart to serve that community and kind of talk through these issues. What are some of the unique features that LOLA is Loss of life Advocates? They’re a group that’s been a resource for us to be able to learn and glean from. Is there anything that you learn from them that you could speak on or just general nature? They gave you a lot of insight into how to communicate.
Haley: Yeah, Esther has so many connections, and so she’s connected me with a bunch of people in the community that help, whether it be from planning your own funeral in the future.
Darryl: Yeah, yeah.
Haley: But also, legal counsel. So, we have legal people that we refer out to because you need to make sure that your will is now up to date. All your beneficiaries are designated properly, so that you have the medical power of attorney because now your spouse is no longer there to step in that gap. Who’s going to be that person for you if you get in a serious accident and you’re, you know who’s going to say, pull the plug or don’t? So, do you have a medical directive? She’s also connected me with people that do, placement for assisted living or independent living.
Darryl: Oh yeah.
Haley: Things like that. So just depends on the stage of life that the widow is in.
Darryl: That’s a really great point because I mean, not only, I know this sounds like a Haley commercial, but I’m a Haley fan. But not only are you helping them navigate these financial items by being a thinking partner, but you’re also pointing them in the right direction, being a resource. That’s good. And I didn’t think about that, too. So, you often think of a widow, you know? Okay. I just need to pay my bills. Do I sell the house? Do I not sell the houses or just big decisions? But the down the road decision that has to be thought of. Okay, now my kids don’t live in the same city. Who’s going to take care of me? Like, you know, I have Alzheimer’s, right?
Haley: Right. Yeah.
Darryl: How do I pay for it?
Haley: Yeah. My mind is running, thinking about all the different widows that I do work with. And one has three kids that live in different places. And she doesn’t have a house right now. She’s living. And so deciding where she wants to live, she’s just pausing right until she knows where is the best place between all of my kids that I want to be as I grow older and, I have another widow who was trying to decide, okay, I have investment properties. Do I buy another one, or should I take that money and invest it in the market instead?
Darryl: Oh yeah, that’s, if you’re comfortable that, you know, that could be an option investing in properties. But that’s just something you just have to be comfortable with. Do any of them, when you think about it, do any of them have to go back to work like the ones that you’re working with now? Or is there enough resources?
Haley: I have not had one yet that has had to go back to work, but that comes with tradeoffs, right? How are you going to live? Are you going to live extravagantly, or are you going to live within the means that you do have? So, there’s those tradeoffs that you have to decide what’s most important.
Darryl: And even then, it maybe you don’t have to work today, but you might need to work tomorrow, right?
Haley: Today might be about making sure the kids are okay and getting them through high school and into college. And then once they’re in college, then maybe if you want to go back to work, you can focus on going back to work. But right now, is grieving and getting the kids through this phase where we’re at.
Darryl: Like, do you help with some of the life insurance stuff, like the claims?
Haley: We can for sure. Yes. And analyzing, does it make sense to leave the money in the life insurance policy? I have one that is looking at that versus do we move it out and put it in other investments that could have a better rate of return?
Darryl: Yeah, because the life insurance companies tend to offer something to retain the money there. So just kind of wrestling with that. And then do you have a tool that can help them think about how to spend money like a budget tool?
Haley: For sure. We do use our cash flow worksheet and look at making sure their needs are covered versus what are their wants and then talking through the wants. How important are those wants? And yes. And then plugging it into the tools.
Darryl: Yeah, because there’s in that cash flow worksheet, I think we have a link in the website. We may or may not, but if not Haley@PAXFG.com, but it’s, wants and needs are separated and it becomes a good conversation piece just to say, okay, you need $5,000 a month, and where’s this money coming from? And Social Security is not going to necessarily be there at 45 if you if your kids are on their own, you know, you’ve got that widow’s blackout period.
Haley: Absolutely. You could,
Darryl: Want to talk about that?
Haley: Well, when you have kids in the home 16 and under, the kids will get Social Security until they turn 18, and graduate high school. And then there’s no widow support from Social Security until age 60.
Darryl: Yeah. So that’s the widow’s blackout. So, like you go, okay, I it’s funny because I, it’s not funny, but the, you know, Social Security Administration knows that somebody died like, right away. And so, they cut that check off.
Haley: And not only do they cut it off, but they’ll like pull it back out of your account. If they already deposited it that month, they’ll take it right back out.
Darryl: It’s insane.
Haley: Yeah.
Darryl: And then you’re a widow and then you’ve got this. You’re like, okay, well, now I’m in this widow’s blackout period, and that could be a surprise.
Haley: Yes. I had one client whose husband died when she was 59, and she was like, dang it. Because she had to,
Darryl: Wait.
Haley: Yeah, wait. And she wasn’t working. And so, then it’s just, okay, where is that money coming from? How am I going to be? Am I going to be okay?
Darryl: And then health insurance too, like.
Haley: And health insurance, that was another one.
Darryl: Because, you know, you get Medicare at 65. But let’s say and we’re using a lot of widows versus widowers that’s been.
Haley: I do have one widower.
Darryl: Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I know we have several clients. But yeah, the, you know, the idea is to get Medicare at 65 and if you’ve lost a spouse and they kind of took all that to take care of the health insurance and we can solve that problem for them. But that’s a tricky one too, making sure that we have adequate health insurance. Yeah, all the little nuances.
Haley: It is very nuanced. Every situation is unique.
Darryl: Everyone’s unique. And then it’s so just our hearts are heavy. You know, to walk through those periods. And yeah, we’ve seen over the years doing this, I’ve seen some pretty traumatic losses of spouses. And it’s been very hard. I’ve been to funerals and,
Haley: The ones that are often a surprise is, the caretaker. So, if one person has got physical limitations or mental limitations and they’re being cared for, often the caretaker is the one who goes first because of stress.
Darryl: Oh, wow.
Haley: And so that comes with all kinds of other things.
Darryl: Oh my goodness. Yeah. And you, you better get your stuff together if that’s the situation. Like making sure that those trust and wills are locked tight because.
Haley: It’s been a big motivator for me to work with other married clients to talk about. Hey, we sincerely need to get your ducks in a row. I know we’ve been talking about this for the last couple years, but I’m not kidding.
Darryl: Yeah.
Haley: Like we really need to get this because if one of you goes, the other one’s going to be left and things, especially with blended families.
Darryl: That’s a really good point. Yeah.
Haley: You know, you may think if you have your IRA and your spouse is 100% beneficiary and then you go before them, but you had kids from a separate marriage. Your child is not going to get anything.
Darryl: Yep. That’s a great point.
Haley: Because it’s going to go to the spouse. And then if they leave it, you know, it’ll go to their kids. Unless you have a will in place that says something otherwise or unless you have it designated properly.
Darryl: All those little things. But your point is well made. Not only are you working with widows, but that’s this experience. This experience that we’ve had, in you working with these widows, translates to those that, you know, need to prepare.
Haley: Speaking about blended families or divorcees even. That’s something that we’ve also seen where someone will leave their 401k at work to their child who is a minor.
Darryl: Yeah.
Haley: And then they die and their child is still a minor, and they go to their spouse, their ex-spouse, and now their ex is the one that gets to say how that money is divvied out. And do you really want your ex being the one in charge of all of that money?
Darryl: A lot of important beneficiary planning for sure. And I’m sure every meeting you check off the beneficiary or however whatever your rhythm is but making sure the beneficiaries are right.
Haley: Yes, yes, I had one that one of my ladies had received, not a widow, but she had received an inheritance from her father. But the beneficiary of it was her current spouse, who was not her kid’s father. And she was saying, well, I want that money that I receive from my dad to flow through to my kids. I was like, well, we need to fix the beneficiaries, because if something happens to you, it’s going to your husband whom you love dearly, and it’s wonderful. But that’s not what you want to happen with this money. So, let’s fix that.
Darryl: Yes, that’s a perfect example of just we’re just too busy in life. Got a lot of stuff going on and having somebody like you walking alongside, making sure, you know, I really appreciate we’re already kind of. We’re almost landing the plane. Can you believe that?
Haley: Thank you.
Darryl: Yeah. You’ve done great. So, when we when we think about this community of widows and let’s say somebody is listening and they just lost their spouse, what would you tell them? Like their first step financially, if anything, and maybe do nothing.
Haley: It’s pause. Get solid good advice from someone you can trust because you’re not thinking straight. You can’t. You’re grieving. You can’t. You’re not thinking straight. And just pause. Don’t make any big decisions without thinking through the ramifications and have someone going through and helping analyze it with you.
Darryl: That’s good.
Haley: Just pause.
Darryl: Are there any community resources that you would recommend, like at some churches that.
Haley: Gosh, you know, there is grief recovery, that is offered at several churches.
Darryl: Okay.
Haley: Verse by Verse Fellowship. CBC, one of my widows actually does it. He leads it.
Darryl: Oh, he facilitates it, good.
Haley: And that’s not just for someone who’s lost a loved one. It’s any kind of grief.
Darryl: Yeah, now you’re on the board of who now?
Haley: I am on the board for the Children’s Bereavement Center of South Texas for their foundation. So not for the center, but for the foundation, which is focused on legacy giving. So, making sure that there is legacy money coming in to continue the work of the Children’s Bereavement Center.
Darryl: But tell people, but as we wrap this up, because it’s kind of, it’s tied in but not tied in to the idea of serving people who’ve lost somebody. But tell us what the bereavement center does.
Haley: They offer free counseling services for people that have children in the home, ages 2 to 22. Pardon me, I’m not sure on the high end. But they walk through grief with the children. It’s mainly the children, they have support things that they do for the spouse parents as well. Yeah. But if you had someone die and there’s a kid in the home ages 2 to early 20s, you can call the children’s bereavement center, and it’s free counseling.
Darryl: Well, thank you for serving in that community, too.
Haley: It’s a great cause. It’s a great group of people.
Darryl: Yeah, well, thank you for all that you do. This is really powerful. Is there a quote or scripture you might be able to?
Haley: I forgot you were going to ask me that, and I didn’t.
Darryl: If not, no big deal.
Haley: I mean, there’s always Romans [8:28]. God works all things for good for those who love Him and are called according to His purpose.
Darryl: Yeah, that’s wonderful.
Haley: And there’s Jeremiah [29:11], right? For I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord. Right. Plans to prosper you and for hope for your future, not to harm you.
Darryl: Yeah, those are good.
Haley: That was not exact.
Darryl: No. That’s good. Thank you so much. I’ll just leave it at that. But thank you so much, Haley, for joining me and sharing kind of what you’re doing for the community. And it’s really important work. It’s God’s work. So thank you.
Haley: Thank you for asking.
Darryl: And all of you who are listening to that stayed to the very end, thank you very much for listening. Be sure to share this episode with your community. And remember you think different when you think long term. Have a great day.
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