In this week’s episode of Retire in Texas, Darryl Lyons, CEO and Co-Founder of PAX Financial Group, sits down with Roger Stukkie – Certified Financial Planner, Certified Kingdom Advisor, and Financial Advisor at PAX – for a thought-provoking conversation about the intersection of faith and finances.
From biblical definitions of generosity to real-world giving strategies, this episode dives into steps you can take to be both a Christian and a steward of your financial resources. Darryl and Roger explore how aligning your money mindset with your faith can lead to deeper fulfillment, more intentional giving, and long-term impact.
Key Highlights Include:
• The difference between becoming a Christian and living as one – especially when it comes to money.
• Why generosity is more about stewardship than sacrifice.
• How to overcome skepticism and give with confidence (even if you don’t fully trust the organization).
• Checks and balances in nonprofit financials and how to evaluate them.
• Two tax-efficient giving strategies every faith-driven investor should know: QCDs and donor-advised funds.
Whether you’re a faith-forward investor or simply exploring how your values align with your financial life, this episode offers practical tools and spiritual insight to help guide your giving.
For more insights or to connect with a PAX Financial Group advisor, visit http://www.PAXFinancialGroup.com
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Transcript:
Darryl: Hey, this is Darryl Lyons, CEO and Co-Founder of PAX Financial Group. And you’re listening to Retire in Texas. This information is general in nature only. It’s not intended to provide specific investment, tax, or legal advice. Visit PAXFinancialGroup.com for more information.
Hey, we got Roger Stukkie here today. I want to do an interview style to share an intersection in life that a lot of people don’t think about deeply. And that’s the collision of our faith and our money. So, Roger’s here to unpack that with us today. He’s a partner and a Certified Financial Planner and Certified Kingdom Advisor here at PAX Financial Group. So welcome.
Roger: Thank you.
Darryl: And so, the teaser at the end of the show, we only have about 15-20 minutes. We like to keep this pretty direct, but the teaser at the end of the show is you’ve got a really dry joke for us, right?
Roger: I do.
Darryl: Okay, good. So, we want you to come with it. So. Okay. So, tell us a little bit about your background. You’re a Midwest guy. Right?
Roger: I am, born in Michigan and grew up in Ohio.
Darryl: Yeah. So, how’d you get down here?
Roger: A woman.
Darryl: Yeah, right.
Roger: My wife lived in San Antonio, and we met through this world of finance. I used to be a wholesaler and covered Texas. So, we got connected, built a relationship, and eventually, moved down here so I can marry her.
Darryl: That’s awesome. So, yeah, we have a mutual friend who is a pastor and said, hey, this is a guy that you might want to take a look at, and we think highly of Ken Hicks. So, shout out to Ken at Heights Church.
Roger: Ken is awesome.
Darryl: And so, he introduced us. And you’ve been on board here for a number of years now. So, it’s been a pleasure to work with you. You really have a heart for the faith community. And I know you’ve done some sermons on the pulpit now, and no weddings or funerals yet,
Roger: I’ve done one wedding. And I actually get a chance to get back into the sermon mode on Labor Day this year.
Darryl: That’s awesome. Yeah. It’s cool. Well, I look forward to hearing that. It’s cool that you’re doing that now. I’ve had a chance to be on the pulpit, you know, numerous times, and it’s such an honor. And there’s a little bit of pressure because you don’t want to mess up, like, you know, these are people that are just, come into the body of Christ for wisdom. And you’re like, I have got to bring it. So, how’d you feel about it?
Roger: First time I did it. I mean, I’ve given hundreds of presentations, which is the nature of the world we work in, in finance. And in some sense, preaching is a presentation, but it’s like directly on the behalf of God. And so, it felt like this much higher pressure of doing well, but which is even funnier because in the end, it’s not even you, you know, you’re just a vessel that the Holy Spirit’s using in that dynamic. So, there should be less pressure. But you just want to represent, well, you know.
Darryl: Yeah. And I think that’s a really good way of saying it. I know there was this one, I don’t remember what church it was at, but there was this pulpit I went up to and on it, it said something like, it’s not you speaking, it’s God speaking through you. I was like, oh, thanks for the reminder. So, this collision of Christianity, namely Christianity and money, you have an interest in that. And it seemed like it spurred a little bit when you went through the CKA curriculum. Did that help kind of spark your curiosity in how Christians think about money? Or did it already exist before that?
Roger: I would say that was probably a catalyst to having a stronger drive to using knowledge and experience to also then help others.
Darryl: I mean, like, but when we talk about Christians, like everyone in Texas, I’ll say Texas. I mean, everyone’s like, I’m a Christian, like Easter. I believe in Jesus. And I go to church on Easter and Christmas. But like I’ve seen other definitions of Christians, can you help us understand when we talk about Christians, maybe. What does that mean?
Roger: Yeah, and funny you mentioned what we would call the CEO Christians. Yeah. Christmas and Easter Only. Yeah. Well, you have to go to the main source of truth, which is the Bible. And Romans 10:9 would say, if we confess with our mouth that Jesus is Lord and we believe in our hearts that he was raised from the dead, then you’ll be saved. So, I think that the simple as how do you become a Christian starts out with a confession of your mouth and an actual heart change, a belief, from that dynamic.
Darryl: Yeah, that makes sense. And then from a byproduct of that is, a desire for your creator and in that relationship and then go into His word and, then there’s fruit from a tree, right? Like, I’ve got a fig tree that’s growing right now. It’s like growing awesome. So, first of all, I know it’s a fig tree. I know it’s healthy. And so, like just like that from Christians who decide to turn away from their old self and turn towards Christ.
Roger: Which is a good point in that there’s two dynamics of Christian. There’s becoming a Christian and then there’s being a Christian. And so, you know, the Romans 10:9, that’s how you become a Christian, but you’re talking a lot more. How do you be a Christian? Which is a lifestyle. It is chasing after God. We’re trying to mimic our lives after Him. And, you know, it’s not a one moment and done thing, but.
Darryl: Yeah, I think there may be some perception out there that it’s a, to check the box and move on. And so that’s it. It’s the lifestyle. And so, then when you talk about lifestyle, you talk about Jesus actually flipping everything upside down, like to turn the other cheek. It’s better to give than to receive. And so, understanding that that lifestyle, requires us to go to that source, which is the word of God. And the word has a lot to say about money.
Roger: Like, over 2000 verses. Talk about money, wealth, just all in that general subject matter.
Darryl: Yeah. I was reading some stuff on that this morning. It’s an exit ramp, but just talking about the historical context of lending and what the early Christians thought about lending. So, there’s, I mean, there’s a lot to unpack when it comes to money, but maybe what are some of the specific things that make Christians think or do or act and express through their money? Is it specifically like tactically, are there things that they do differently?
Roger: The biggest one or probably the most obvious would be generosity. You know, we’re called to be generous, but that starts from the mindset of God owns it all. And so, when you start from that aspect, we’re not giving away our stuff. We are stewards or managers of what God has entrusted us with. And I think that is what, that’s the big spot is how much should we give in our generosity. And then sometimes there’s the helping, the where do we give in our generosity. And what does that look like and how do we do it effectively, efficiently, things like that.
Darryl: That’s a really good point. So, the idea is, I’m kind of paraphrasing. So just help me make sure I’m picking up what you drop. And the idea is, is that Christians, as part of their fruit, part of that fig tree is we should see a little bit more generosity. I mean, is that a fair statement?
Roger: It is.
Darryl: And then the question which you brought up, which is kind of cool, is like, okay, where does that go? How do we do it? Who you know, who does it as Christians. But like, where does it go? Do you ever have conversations about that piece, like where Christians come in and say, I want to give, but I don’t know, where does that sometimes happen? Or do they already know where to go?
Roger: Not always. I mean, I believe heavily in, you know, the first fruits of giving back should be in some dynamic to your home church. Which we can call that tithing. But, as I’ve learned and studied and done more, I’m not so locked in that God calls us all to do 10%. I truly feel giving is a one-on-one conversation between you and God.
Yeah, there’s different phases of life where that number could be different. But then when you go above and beyond and let’s say you get outside the church walls, people have things that are important to them that are like, near and dear to their heart as far as subject matters or topics, but they don’t know organizations that they could trust that would utilize their dollars efficiently or, in the right way.
Darryl: What would you say to somebody that’s like, I’m a Christian. I want to be generous. I just don’t trust the church, or I don’t trust any of these nonprofits. You know, it’s all going to executive compensation. What would you say to that?
Roger: Yeah. Almost I would encourage them to release them from that thought and that God commands us to give. And then after that we’re done, like the recipient of what we have given our money to, that becomes, how do you use that money, that’s between them and God. So, I mean, you could get caught up in that.
I don’t think they’re being effective or they’re doing money right, or the church isn’t using it properly. And there is some concept we do want to give to the right places. But at the end of the day, your obedience in your heart is to give and to trust that God has it.
Darryl: That’s so good. Because the, you know, this conversation has come up over the years and a Christian might say, well, I want to be a good steward. And that’s a card that we play a lot as Christians. I want to be a good steward. So, what we’re saying is that I’m not going to give it all because I want to be a good steward because I don’t trust.
And so, what you’re telling me is that, hey, look, that idea that you want to be a good steward, that, you know, just suspend that for just a second because God’s calling you to give. And I think it’s almost ironic that if you would even go to church and be unwilling to give financially the church because you don’t trust them, but you’re willing to be in the service every Sunday, that’s kind of an irony.
That’s something that we need to take inventory of. But it is important, I think, that, yeah, it’s a really good point. Like trust God that He’s going to, and I’m very cerebral. So, this is hard for me to digest. But yeah, you trust God that He’s going to work it out for good. And is there any accountability or do you just kind of just blindly just let it go?
Roger: I mean, I guess it would depend on what you’re doing. You know, when you’re giving to organizations, there still has to be some dynamic of are we giving into the right place for our dollars to be maximized or utilized well, or to further the kingdom? I think there’s a component of that. But there’s other spaces. I think the most challenging spaces you think about, someone begging on the corner, you know, you hit up a stoplight and they’re like, anything helps.
And then we would always think, like, why am I giving my money? They’re just going to go buy alcohol or drugs like that. Or and that was the concept where I first heard, like, well, that parts beyond what God’s talking to you about. He just said give. And then what they do with it, you know, so there are different scenarios where you let it go, or you do need to follow through.
Darryl: That’s so good. Can I double click on that because we’re already running out of time, but this is good because. So, let’s use Ransom Life. Tell people about Ransom Life. You’re on that board.
Roger: Yeah. Ransom Life is doing amazing things in the space of human trafficking. Which is a terrible space that exists. But essentially, we do two things. We mentor and we counsel young boys and girls who have either been trafficked and are highly at risk of being trafficked. And then on the other side, we do a lot of great work in the preventative education space. We’ve got the approved criteria, and we go into all the schools, hospitals, churches and educate people on what that looks like.
Darryl: It’s awesome. So, I’m going to go to this giving. I’m going to stay on this giving theme and use this as an example. Somebody says, you know, my heart is to give. I just haven’t done it because I don’t trust nonprofits. They hear about Ransom Life and they’re like, I hate human trafficking. It disgusts me. I want to give to this nonprofit. And you’re like, wow, that’s great. Thank you. I’m on the board. That’s part of what we have to do. But then they say, you know what? I just don’t trust that you guys are going to do a good job with the money. Tell me about how checks and balances work in nonprofits.
Roger: Yeah, funny, if somebody really wanted to give and they didn’t trust what things were going on, I would say, why don’t you join the board and be a part, right?
Darryl: Yeah. That’s easy, yeah.
Roger: Let’s stop using these easy scapes, I don’t trust it. So, I won’t do it and just get involved. But there are checks and balances. I mean, you got a full board, and you got all the positions on the board. You know, the presidents, there’s the treasurer, there’s the dynamics. We have outside accounting firms that are helping you.
And when you look at money on a monthly basis, you know, we’ve laid out a budget that gets reviewed every single month. You constantly are reviewing. Did the money go to where we set it? Are we growing in the right space, is where we wanted money to get invested, resulting in the, you know, what we were expecting? So, the checks and balances go way beyond just one executive director is making all these decisions.
Darryl: This is a good point. So, what I’m trying to get at is that okay, so let’s say we’re going, hopefully people gone along this journey with us in this cerebral process, in fact, that okay, we recognize what’s the difference between a Christian that has fruit and that doesn’t, what’s a Christian non-Christian. And you define that for us. And then what fruit looks like. And part of that is generosity a big part because the word of God talks about it a lot.
So, if somebody here like, hey, I don’t reflect that generosity. My heart is starting to change. But I still have concerns about nonprofit boards. I wanted you to share that example, because a lot of nonprofit boards have a ton of checks and balances, and I’ve spoken to thousands of nonprofit boards, and rarely do I come up with one that’s not and, you know, has at least the very least the intentions of being prudent in its construction.
Roger: And not to get technical with tax forms and things like that. But there’s a 990 form which goes through all of the finances of a nonprofit, which is public. So, it would be really tricky to be disingenuous with the money that was coming in when everything has to be recorded how it’s being used in the numbers that anybody can go and look and check. If you truly didn’t trust what was going on, you could do a little bit of research, and you can validate either your concerns or you can dismiss them because there’s proof that things are being taken care of in a good way.
Darryl: The last thing I want to talk about before we closed, land the plane, so to speak, so, now let’s talk about how to give some people give directly out of their paycheck each month. Some people do lump sums because they’ve got variability in income, but there’s some investment strategy. Can you speak to maybe 1 or 2 of those strategies for people to be just more effective, maybe even the idea when I say strategies is you reduce your taxable income to a certain degree.
Roger: Yeah. Which, we don’t have enough time to dive into the dynamic. But generosity doesn’t always have to mean tax deduction as well, which is maybe something that I need to improve on. Like I can help things without getting on a tax form to reduce my income. But specifically, how do we give and get tax benefits? Two spaces would be something called a QCD, which is a Qualified Charitable Distribution. Once you hit the age of 70.5, you can give money directly to 501(C) organizations out of your qualified accounts.
Darryl: Big. And by the way, the reason is that it’s big because the one big beautiful bill provides an enhanced standard deduction for those who are over 65. And so, if you properly construct the QCD and it gets you below those thresholds, you can actually get that enhanced credit. And if you don’t pay attention to it, you might miss the enhanced credit. So, this is fresh off the press. And so, I’m really interested. Explore this further.
Roger: And when people are often giving, they’re not giving enough to exceed the standard deduction. So, you’re getting points for being obedient in your heart, but you’re not getting tax points. And so, when you do the QCD the money never hits your taxable income. And so that’s how you can benefit in both spaces.
Darryl: It’s an awesome strategy yeah.
Roger: And the other one is just they’re called donor advised funds or charitable accounts or things like that. It’s where you can move almost anything. You can move property, business interests, stocks, actual cash into an account. You can get tax deductions for the fair value of stuff that goes in there and then remain in control of these assets to be able to divi them out to 501(C)s at your time frame in your request.
So, another way to really get into some really cool, complex strategies of how do we get huge tax deductions by dropping money in a donor advised fund in conjunction with doing big Roth conversions. So, we’re not feeling tax bills and we’re just improving all over the place. So, there’s really cool things, that you start getting into that help with taxes but also help with what you’re trying to accomplish from a generosity.
Darryl: I love that you do that. This is just amazing. So, thank you. It starts with the heart. So, I love that I’m trying to try to go full circle here. Really does start with the heart I got to land the plane. So, what’s our joke. Okay wait, first of all it’s really cheesy. I already told that.
Roger: Sure, I mean, it’s. I tried to come here with a joke that was related to Christians and money. So, this is the best I could get. Because how do we know that Peter was a rich fisherman?
Darryl: I don’t know.
Roger: By his net income.
Darryl: Okay, I dig it, okay. Thank you. All right. So, hey, thank you very much for coming today. This has been great. I gave you questions in advance, and we covered none of them, right?
Roger: Hey, we covered what a Christian was. And if that’s all you get out of this podcast, I think we’re advancing the kingdom there.
Darryl: Yeah, go rewind it and listen to that part again. All right. Thank you very much for listening and tuning in to the very end. And make sure, as I haven’t mentioned this enough, please share this with other people. They need to hear this specific episode. This one’s very important that other people hear. How do you collide your money with your faith?
And I think we did a good job covering a lot of different areas. And you will probably want to unpack them further. We have plenty of other previous episodes that cover donor advised funds and QCDs and some of these other topics. So go back and look at the inventory for Retire in Texas on the website. And remember you think different when you think long term. Have a great day.
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